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Not all problems are solved with a KISS

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    Not all problems are solved with a KISS

    Having sorted out beds, rabbits, snakes and other creatures in the General Camping Forum I want to challenge the thinking behind the acronym KISS, which has gained some prominence on another thread.

    I assume the acronym means: "Keep it simple, stupid", but this is demeaning: the person addressed is labelled as inadequate, which may be unintentional. Probably those using the acronym are in fact being self-deprecating, and referring to themselves, but that's not how the syntax works. If they mean "simple and stupid", clearly they are calling for shoddy work.

    I think it may be helpful to put the case for complexity both in life (eg: reject fundamentalism, whether religious or atheist), and in the workplace. Apart from the nostalgia, who would want a Trojan motorhome van built in 1910 (if Trojan was building vans in 1910 - later, I think this was a marque of Bradford)?

    Modern artifacts of all kinds are incredibly sophisticated which usually means complicated, and I see this as a good thing. They are more reliable and far more user-friendly. Our recently acquired Doblo, which may be a fairly average vehicle, astonishes me in this regard.

    A marine example of this progress is the lapse of the Seagull outboard motor. It was famous and it was British, and it was sometimes sold under the banner "What isn't there can't go wrong". They rarely did. But they were inefficient and polluting, and current outboards are far superior. The banner is amusing and that is always good, but you could equally say "What isn't there can't go right".

    So in the amazing complexity of the requirements for fitting out a campervan to a high standard - in my view more complex than a motorhome due to the constraints of space and multi-use - "simple" will NOT do.

    What you CAN do is say: "I'll just sleep in it, and cook in a tent". Or the other way round. That is, you can reduce your expectations. But I think that is a pity, and where there is a problem I adopt the engineer's viewpoint: "There is always a technical fix". It just takes a lot of thinking out and planning, and the resulting arrangements can be tricky to make.

    Would that I could say: "There is always a political / social / medical fix". But that day is a long way off.

    That's my little homily, Paul.

    PS I'm glad I don't have to do it commercially.
    Seek to make a virtue of necessity.

    #2
    twin1

    Originally posted by Doblo7 View Post
    Having sorted out beds, rabbits, snakes and other creatures in the General Camping Forum I want to challenge the thinking behind the acronym KISS, which has gained some prominence on another thread.

    I assume the acronym means: "Keep it simple, stupid", but this is demeaning: the person addressed is labelled as inadequate, which may be unintentional. Probably those using the acronym are in fact being self-deprecating, and referring to themselves, but that's not how the syntax works. If they mean "simple and stupid", clearly they are calling for shoddy work.

    I think it may be helpful to put the case for complexity both in life (eg: reject fundamentalism, whether religious or atheist), and in the workplace. Apart from the nostalgia, who would want a Trojan motorhome van built in 1910 (if Trojan was building vans in 1910 - later, I think this was a marque of Bradford)?

    Modern artifacts of all kinds are incredibly sophisticated which usually means complicated, and I see this as a good thing. They are more reliable and far more user-friendly. Our recently acquired Doblo, which may be a fairly average vehicle, astonishes me in this regard.

    A marine example of this progress is the lapse of the Seagull outboard motor. It was famous and it was British, and it was sometimes sold under the banner "What isn't there can't go wrong". They rarely did. But they were inefficient and polluting, and current outboards are far superior. The banner is amusing and that is always good, but you could equally say "What isn't there can't go right".

    So in the amazing complexity of the requirements for fitting out a campervan to a high standard - in my view more complex than a motorhome due to the constraints of space and multi-use - "simple" will NOT do.

    What you CAN do is say: "I'll just sleep in it, and cook in a tent". Or the other way round. That is, you can reduce your expectations. But I think that is a pity, and where there is a problem I adopt the engineer's viewpoint: "There is always a technical fix". It just takes a lot of thinking out and planning, and the resulting arrangements can be tricky to make.

    Would that I could say: "There is always a political / social / medical fix". But that day is a long way off.

    That's my little homily, Paul.

    PS I'm glad I don't have to do it commercially.


    I think I must lead a very sheltered life Paul, I have never heard of it. twin1
    Last edited by T1; 19-10-2011, 18:38. Reason: twin1

    Comment


      #3
      "Would that I could say: "There is always a political / social / medical fix". But that day is a long way off.

      That's my little homily, Paul."

      What you could say is that there is always a political/ social/ medical fix, but it takes time and money. For example we could probably find a quicker cure for cancer if the world did not spend its resources of scientific research and money on producing ever more sophisticated weapons. We could abolish world starvation if we regarded the human race as custodians of the planet's resources instead of having world commodity markets based on making money for traders. But most of all we could have a different world if the human trait of greed could be isolated and cured. Yes, that is Utopian but somebody has to believe that, however little we do, it can change things, otherwise we would all be little islands of family fighting the neighbours because they are different.

      That's my little homily
      Colin

      Comment


        #4
        "That's my little homily
        Colin"[/QUOTE]

        And I quite agree.
        Paul.
        Seek to make a virtue of necessity.

        Comment


          #5
          if aint broke dont tinker with it and try and improve it and if it does the job does it have to look pretty ,the second doesnt apply to the female of the species oops duck and cover time

          Comment


            #6
            Quite right, Ageing Hippy. Be very careful else your moniker will have to change to Aged Hippy Long Gone!!

            Di.

            Comment


              #7
              Getting younger

              I think Aging Hippy is looking back to "fixing" existing things. Since I passed 65 many years ago I have been getting younger, and I find I still look forwards to thinking out and making new things rather than maintaining old ones. As a result the place is cluttered with projects.

              So my little homily referred to new construction and the need to grasp the nettle of a full and long-term technical resolution of difficulties, even when these solutions may be complicated.

              By the way, if vehicles like the one shown in Aging Hippy's pic had been milling about when I caught the motor caravanning bug I might have gone for one of them. I find "she" looks functional and attractive, and a nice size. (I'm not referring to Aging Hippy's "female of the species", but no doubt I could be).

              Paul.
              Seek to make a virtue of necessity.

              Comment


                #8
                Well "KISS" could not be applied to THESE posts!
                Jim.
                Keeping people waiting is stealing a part of their lives.

                Comment


                  #9
                  I am looking forward to meeting Paul and Colin in the Spring,We can split a bottle or two and exchange views.
                  I am a solopsistic maltheusian Marxist,with strong lamarkian and newtonian tendancies,all backed up with a classical education,love of literature and poetry,and nearly 50 years as an experimental technician. Oh,and I prefer classical music and pigs.
                  Young men sow wild oats.Old men grow sage.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    OUCH! Ouch! Ouch!
                    Keeping people waiting is stealing a part of their lives.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Twolitre View Post
                      OUCH! Ouch! Ouch!
                      HoHoHo,sorry Jim,you come and help us drain the bottle eh? You know more about engineering than most,you taught it,I taught brewing and microbiology.
                      Young men sow wild oats.Old men grow sage.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Ian, a man for all seasons

                        Originally posted by Ian STOCKLEY View Post
                        I am looking forward to meeting Paul and Colin in the Spring,We can split a bottle or two and exchange views.
                        I am a solopsistic maltheusian Marxist,with strong lamarkian and newtonian tendancies,all backed up with a classical education,love of literature and poetry,and nearly 50 years as an experimental technician. Oh,and I prefer classical music and pigs.
                        Good heavens, Ian, and that's when you're sober!
                        Graham (and Carole)

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Ian STOCKLEY View Post
                          I am a solopsistic maltheusian Marxist,with strong lamarkian and newtonian tendancies
                          Have you seen a doctor? It sounds serious.
                          Graham
                          Did you know you can follow us on Facebook, YouTube and Twitter or you can visit us at our Website

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Classical matters

                            Ian Stockley wrote:
                            "I am looking forward to meeting Paul and Colin in the Spring,We can split a bottle or two and exchange views.
                            I am a solopsistic maltheusian Marxist,with strong lamarkian and newtonian tendancies,all backed up with a classical education,love of literature and poetry,and nearly 50 years as an experimental technician. Oh,and I prefer classical music and pigs".

                            We will need more than one bottle, Ian, since all the attendees will want to come (plus dogs, rabbits, snakes* and hamsters). Before or after our fish supper?

                            I take issue with you over your use of the word "solipsistic" - you are not even an egoist, let alone an egotist judging by your major contribution to the working of this Forum. I take it that the word "solipsistic" caused Jim's "OUCH" and "Marxian" only occasioned an "ouch". So that's better. Or it may have been the spelling.

                            I infer that you prefer classical music to pop, but what animals are not so good as pigs? ("Prefer" implies a choice).

                            Looking forward to next April, Paul.

                            * That's if Flo takes up my suggestion of adopting and training (and bringing) a rattlesnake.
                            Seek to make a virtue of necessity.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Ian STOCKLEY View Post
                              ......
                              I am a solopsistic maltheusian Marxist,with strong lamarkian and newtonian tendancies.......
                              I thought he meant " I am a persistently poorly solo actor, who loves Marks and Spencers and young sheep, and who sits under trees waiting for apples to fall on his head"!
                              Perhaps the "OUCH" was the thought of the apple doing a Newton on my pippin!
                              Jim.
                              Now ware is mie dixshunery?
                              Last edited by Twolitre; 20-10-2011, 18:37.
                              Keeping people waiting is stealing a part of their lives.

                              Comment

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